Burning of coal
(Jack Murrell of Manapouri's providing me with opportunities to expand my programme of informing Southlanders of what's happening in terms of the Government's plans fossil fuel extraction in Southland with this latest letter. I've sent my reply away and hope to see it appear as ink on newsprint sometime soon.I had previously accused Jack of wanting to sell the ground beneath our feet...)
I would only sell the ground beneath our feet if the buyer agreed to take Robert Guyton as part of the deal. Digging up our coal would not affect our climate at all.
If the burning of coal in China doubled the carbon dioxide content of the air across the world our apples, pears, cow-pasture grass, would grow twice as well. Bring on the day.
I'm a bit annoyed that Mr Guyton did not stay at school long enough to know that already.
As for the wealth I seek for us all, kindly extrapolate the purchases we might make . More demand for aluminium, secure jobs for our smelter workers. Keep a cool head about cause and effect.
Jack Murrell
Manapouri
28 comments:
Jack the lord gave us this commandment You must love your neighbour as I have loved you.
What is love respect understanding appreciation not harming etetc
Jack every CO2 released by China is affecting the climate ..while you are smugly living in a lovely place like Fiordland others ( your neighbour ) in Asia including China are dealing with horrific extreme weather patterns which is killing lots and lots and destroying crops homes etc etc.
I suggest Jack you get your smug self out of the pit hole you are in and think about honouring the lords commandment remembering how good he has been to you !!
Dr Patrick Moore .... co founder of greenpeace,
\" we do not have any scientific proof that we are the cause of global warming over the last 200 years"
BS Buster ..we are all human and therefore even the founder of Greenpeace is capable of getting it wrong ...
I suggest you stop being a denoier of reality that CO2 is a major contributor to the climate problems we are having at this moment ....particularly in the Northern hemisphere ( when you consider that US and then China both in the NH are the biggest cO2 polluters in the globe it is poetic justice they are suffering with climate extreme weather patterns.)
Don't believe me google extreme weather ...you will discover not only the US is suffering from abnormal extreme weather patterns it but as well Russia China India Pakistan etc etc....
The arctic and antarctic ice is melting due to excessive CO2 in the atmosphere which is causing the warming up of the climate..it is from these Northern and Southern circles of the globe where the global weather begins it journey around the globe ..........
..
Pauline's beating the BS out of Buster!
to believe that less than .4 of 1% which is the concentration of co2 in the atmosphere will cause catastrophic warming is absurd,
please , do some research .
the only deniers around here are those who have chosen to believe in the myth of co2.
the biggest greenhouse gas is of course water vapor at 95% of the atmosphere.
its just a shame u cant sell it , trade it . sequester it , or draw a shonky graph about it ,
the earth has been both significantly warmer and cooler , co2 has been both significantly more abundant and less so.
the fact that the earth radiates heat to space at a much greater rate than ipcc models assumed obviously prove the models used and the predictions you believe are in fact wrong, incorrect, flawed, mythical , and as is self evident unscientific .
its a psuedo science scam of the highest order
i often wonder why people accept popular opinion without doing their own research.
the facts win out in the end of course ,
and the present fact that the earths temp is not following the modeled prediction of the IPCC should immediately alert you that the science is demonstrably flawed ,
I don't know why it happened, BS Buster, but the tide of public opinion turned on the climate change issue, early last week. It's quite odd and I can't claim to know what caused the shift, but there we are. I'm not going to squabble over the details any more, nor am I going to slight those who haven't 'done the Canute'. It may be the corn crop issue in the States, I'm willing to surmise. That might have been it. Either way.
BS Buster I did four years of study of the environment to gained my information ..for which I now have a degree in environment management.
ALL you have presented is evidence from a pseudo source that provides pseudo evidence to justify their pseudo claims to climate change deniers that all is ladeda wonderful....... that us humans and our greed can do what we like and we are never responsible for the consequences of our actions and the negative effect on our neighbours ...
I suspect you and Jack would say to all those suffering from extreme weather patterns tough shit after all I all right I AM NOT BEING EFFECTED (as direct result of the global circle ice disappearing re excessive CO2 in the atmosphere)
unfortunatly u obviously didnt study atmospheric physics , meteorology, and are yet to read such authorities as dr easterbrook on co2.
to confuse climate with weather is your first mistake ,, it is interesting that in fact public opinion is not moving to support global warming it is moving to question the science ,, the money go round and the fact that , the theory has not demonstrated fact ,
but by all means beleive what u wish,,
the fact the earth is more than 1 degree cooler than ipcc models predicted ,
we have seen man made global warming watered down to climate change and now retrenched again to climate variability as people struggle to reconcile co2 hysteria and place it within the context that the earth is in a cooling trend as obviously dictated by the pacific decadal occilation.
this is historically known, predicted, observed and recorded repeatedly. as you would expect from robust scientific observation.
o a degree in environmental management ..... please show me some published and peer reiewed orgional science in the field of climatology,, because unless you can show me its just hot air
Ha. Go buster you good thing. Rob and Pauline- up in smoke.
BS buster. Your spelling,grammar and typing aren't up to much and your understanding of science is even worse. You don't appear to understand how the scientific processes of research & observation & peer review lead to a scientific consensus. That consensus tells us that anthropogenic climate change is real.
You said "i often wonder why people accept popular opinion without doing their own research.
the facts win out in the end of course "
Do you really expect people to do their own research on greenhouse gas emissions? Will you attempt to carry out a double blind controlled experiment next time your GP wants you to take some medication?
You are correct in one thing you say, the facts WILL win out in the end.
Correction,
there is not scientific consensus on the subject of man made global warming ,
there is in fact a huge amount of scientific debate , based on up to date research, which brings into question the assumptions made by ipcc . particularly those assumptions based on cooked data ,
and in fact the hockey stick graph based on flawed proxy data by prof mann, was dropped from later ipcc reports,
this is very significant because the hockey stick graph was constructed to mislead and did not demonstrate the medievil warm period and the subsequent little ice age ,
both these demonstrate that climate is and has been a dynamic and changing cyclical event unrelated to atmospheric co2
and i say again,, do your own research and investigate the scientific commentary which is obviously available ,
or do your subscribe to the ideal that it is only the priests of global warming who maintain and hold the true knowledge and dogma and we can only sit and listen in awe unquestioning in our obedient observance of this sacred smoke and mirrors flim flam exercise .
i for one am not content to pay financial homage and pauperize the world by adherence to such a psuedoscience scam
The corn belt disaster, BS? Nothing to do with climate change? The US Military doesn't seem to share your views on global warming. At all.
CORRECT nothing to do with climate change .
the driest event was in fact 1934 when 80% of the continental united states was affected .. and if you look at the records the hottest from memory was in fact 1923
this drought is about middle of the pack as far as area affected
the interesting point there is both the thirties and twenties were pre industrial co2 increase and the moderate or slight cooling period from the 50s to the 70s was also supposedly when co2 increase should have had an influence ,,
so ,, co2 and climate ,,, they are not related.. directly
It used to be frustrating, BS Buster, listening to people like you argue that AGW was not happening. I'd despair at your intransigence, puzzle over how it could be that you were unable to balance the multitude of opinions on the issue with good sense, worry that your opinions might influence others who were unable to sort the wheat from the chaff, but now I don't! I don't mind at all what you say. With my new approach, your voice and those of your 'mates', sound odd, quaint and distant. I don't mean it in a bad way - you are very welcome to share your views here, but I just thought you might like a little feedback on how you're being received. Sort of the way an old dog-trialist might look at a new huntaway pup :-)
aghhhhhhhh" grasshopper " i see you have gained enlightenment and are now open to a greater truth
US military. Climate change experts? Great to see you seeking the appropriate expertise again Robert. Now where is my wheetbix again?
Robert @6.36pm
Given that you appear not to be willing to consider viable views on debate, what is the point blogging?
How does a single event in one country prove Gorebull Warmening? Interesting to note global catastrophes are below normal in 2012 - http://www.munichre.com/en/media_relations/press_releases/2012/2012_07_13_press_release.aspx
Food for thought?
BTW there is nothing 'scientific' in consensus. That is not the way science works. It is however the way politics works and therein lies the answer of where Gorebull warming comes from.
Paranormal
BS Buster @6:48 True, Sensai.
Peak Oil next.
Anonymous@7:15 Your dismissal of the US Military as a 'canary in the mine' for world events is...cute.
Do some more reading, Anon.
Anonymous@7:25
"Given that you appear not to be willing to consider viable views on debate, what is the point blogging?"
You didn't notice this statement from me @6:36?
" I don't mind at all what you say. With my new approach, your voice and those of your 'mates', sound odd, quaint and distant. I don't mean it in a bad way - you are very welcome to share your views here"
Don't beat yourself up over it - failing to read thoroughly is the reason you hold to your quaint views on climate change.
Paranormal - "How does a single event in one country prove Gorebull Warmening?"
True to form, you set up a strawman and proceed to anguish over it. No one made the claim you have.
Same old...
RG your blog is full of it - and also what you claim you haven't said. What about your recent claim that gorebull warmening that caused the US drought is killing hummingbirds?
Sooo, Paulinem suggesting that <-i>"US and then China both in the NH are the biggest cO2 polluters in the globe it is poetic justice they are suffering with climate extreme weather patterns."<-/i> has nothing to do with her faith in the new religion?
Yet again you when facts are pointed out you call for a strawman timeout.
BS Buster has called you out for your BS.
Paranormal
What on earth is 'gorebull waremening', paranormal, and can you please cut and paste where I've claimed that gorebull waremening has killed hummingbirds? I despair at your wild assertions and inability to back them up with a single example.
BS Buster can 'call me out' as often as he likes but as I explained to him, it matters not a whit to me now, as I'm not touched by his arguments, adroit and riveting as they may, or mat not, be. I'd like to be, but I'm just not moved any longer by the story he's offering. Can't help it. Grew up, probably.
Robert .. you have a perfect right to believe what ever you wish,,
but if your going to claim your belief is a universal truth,, and everyone else should also believe as you do .. then you need to come up with facts.
What is killing the Hummingbirds then RG? Is it really pm's nasty CO2 emmissions that I cut and pasted above?
And you should tell me what this Gorebull Warmeing is that your religion is based. As I see it, it is a political movement based on lies and half truths from the political left including some ex democrat politician and dishonest scientists amongst others. All in the thrall of big government money.
But that's right, you have taken the enlightened attitude that nothing will change your faith in it.
Paranormal
Relax, BS Buster, I've not decreed that everyone should believe as I do. In fact I said,
" I don't mind at all what you say. With my new approach, your voice and those of your 'mates', sound odd, quaint and distant. I don't mean it in a bad way - you are very welcome to share your views here".
There are, as I've alluded, facts aplenty that lead me to believe what I do. The need to supply them, is something you might hold, but I'm not moved to pander to your insistance. You'll not change your thinking in response, I'm pretty sure of that, so why would I go to the trouble? I'm moving ahead assured that my decision is a sound one.
Paranormal - you don't read closely. I don't mean to criticise, but it's a fault I've noticed over time. Here's the evidence - please test it logically and see if I'm correct or not. Here's what I said:
"Hummingbirds under threat
From what?
Climate change, what else? The droughts across the United States of America are threatening the hummingbird populations that require the nectar of flowering plants...that require water in order to flower."
Hummingbirds are under threat...not being killed, as you claim: "What is killing the Hummingbirds then RG?", and they are under threat from starvation from the failure of flowering plants to produce the flowers and nectar the hummingbirds need, to answer your question, ""What is killing the Hummingbirds then RG?".
The role that climate change is playing in this is central, I believe. Mind you, it's not a scientifically presented article, just one that's worth regarding, for those who are watchful for the effects of climate change, on the natural world and its systems, as I am.
Don't you care about the plight of the hummingbirds, paranormal? Do you not have a heart :-)
As I have said before RG I have a heart, and I'm also old enough to have a mind (to be clear that's paraphrasing Churchill).
Thank you for clarifying that you believe climate change is behind the drought. That was my understanding from your post. That was why I provided my link that shows natural catastrophes are below normal this year to date. It points to the drought being part of natural seasonal variation rather than some global phenomenon.
Similar to the drought Northland experienced two years ago I am very sympathetic to wildlife welfare. It's just we disagree on the best way to assist. Local action to provide alternative food would be the best. Whereas you want us all to take drastic action that would have no impact and limit our ability to assist wildlife when this type of event occurs.
I have seen hummingbirds in the wild and was amazed. That is why I believe a local response that would directly assist hummingbirds and other wildlife is the best option.
Paranormal
Paranormal said:
"Thank you for clarifying that you believe climate change is behind the drought."
You are missing the important point, para.
I believe it's highly likely that climate change is behind the drought. Therefore, I'm going to behave as though it is the reason and act accordingly. I won't be paralyzed by the slim possibility that it's just 'natural seasonal variation'.
Hope that's clearer.
"I have seen hummingbirds in the wild and was amazed. That is why I believe a local response that would directly assist hummingbirds and other wildlife is the best option."
Agreed. That's the first-line action and I note Americans are doing just that. Second thing to do, attack the cause of the problem.
I've never seen a hummingbird in the real world and it's one reason I would travel - to see such wonders; tiny frogs, bats, snakes, condors, mudskippers and every plant imaginable.
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